Childless for Christ

New Warhorn Media post by Nathan Alberson:

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If somebody really really really wants to serve God in a really cool and exciting way, but they also want to get married, is it okay for them not to have kids? Pastor John Piper says yes, in certain cases. The gang on Sound of Sanity begs to differ. Plus another awkward chapter in the love-life of awkward recent-homeschool graduate Mary Elizabeth Murphy. Will Ollie join her in missions work?

Here’s the article we examined.

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To affirm something Jake was arguing, Bethlehem Baptist has dealt pastorally with sexual sin in missionaries on at least one occasion. Listened to this sermon a few years ago:

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Really great episode.

This is a great example of the danger of podcasts and online ministries. Everyone wants to ask a John Piper, a Doug Wilson, a John MacArthur, an RC Sproul, or even a Tim Bayly for their blessing. Just give me a rule. Give me a blessing about what I can and can’t do. Nevermind the individual, pastoral context of in my own life. Just assume I’m in good working order and give me a yay or nay.

There is no replacement for pastoral care and the relationships involved in actual fellowship in the church. The local church, firing on all pistons, is the only institution that can properly address these kinds of questions for individuals. Internet ministries are only equipped to comment on the abstract. When they try to go beyond that, and venture to affirming specific individuals, people will inevitably suffer harm.

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Sketches were incredible on this one, too.

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I have a certain fondness for one of the performers.

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I always wonder who the additional performers are. They don’t get acknowledged at the end. I don’t have a problem with that, nor do I know if its intentional or an oversight. The performers always seem to do a good job.

I wonder what others think about couples who choose to adopt instead of having biological children. I agree with adoption. It is a form of fruitfulness. I’ve adopted myself. But the decision to forego biological children and only adopt seems unnatural and disordered. I guess it depends on the reasons to some degree.

Thoughts?

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Completely agree. It is caused by some really basic misunderstandings. Overpopulation. Desire to avoid pregnancy and its difficulties. Idea that we have to take care of every other suffering person in the world before we should bring more children into the world. Or, probably at best, just the same lack of faith to have “too many” children that a lot of us today suffer from.

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Our cast does a really fantastic job and deserve a ton of credit. We’ve credited them in various places but never in the episodes themselves. We should do a yearly thank you or something. I guess its kind of fun not to do it in every episode, for some reason…

Luckily they are all getting paid BIG BUCKS for their trouble.

I think the whole “adopt instead of conceive” thing is pretty analogous to everything we’re talking about in the episode.

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I’m about halfway through this episode and it is really great, as are the comments above.

I hope you don’t mind a small criticism of style of the podcast. You guys talked over each other more than once and it was jarring. I think maybe all three of you were talking at once at one point. I thought it was a malfunction of my podcast player at first. We want to hear what you are saying, so please try not to do that too often!:smile:

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The trouble, though, is that pastors will not often have insight into the ‘other’ ministries their flock will be following, online or otherwise. Shepherds will find their sheep listening to them with one ear, but to other shepherds from their other ear, so to speak. On a good day, this means the sheep are taking responsibility for their own feeding and well-being. On a bad day …

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The sketches I think are what’s really great about warhorn media. Sanityville is great content. We need good content and I’m glad someone is making it. I appreciate all the reviews you guys do, but I think even more I appreciate the media/sketches you produce.

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Aww thanks :heart_eyes:

Wow, this one really reminded me of us when we were that age. We were blessed with an “accidental” pregnancy several months into our marriage, which disrupted our original plans to “wait a few years” before having kids. Had we succeeded, knowing us now, I doubt we would ever have had kids. As it was, we stopped at one (vasectomy), again with the justification that since we intended to be missionaries (I come from a family of 'em), it would be easier to relocate. (In reality I was afraid and selfish of our time and energy) And we were “open to adoption” at some point. Fast forward to 12 years later and we still had the one. We made a half-hearted attempt at adoption here in Japan that was probably doomed to failure when we started. Now looking back at all of our decisions, we can clearly see how selfish and self-deceptive we were, and we have repented. My advice to young couples now is to have your kids early and often and don’t repeat our mistakes. The only-child family dynamics are not ideal or healthy in the long run. So while we were saved from the specific doom described in the show, we still managed to make some sinful decisions that have reduced our impact. Thank God for his goodness in other areas, as we haven’t been entirely useless. We are trying to course correct now, returning home to reintegrate into our extended family, hoping to be an influence for Christ now and in the future, looking into fostering/adoption options. Hoping to find godly mentors and peers who can speak into our lives and call us on our self-deception. Anyway, thanks for the painful reminder of my foolish youth, hoping others will heed the warning.

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I think we all know lots of stories like that, which is one of the main reasons why we wanted to do the episode. It’s good to hear stories of repentance, too, so thank you for sharing yours. Praying that God is merciful to you as you course correct.

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This was a shockingly bad take by John Piper. Because the Great Commission is so daunting (just today the Beja and Bedawi people of Sudan came up on my prayer app… 2.4 M people… 0.00% evangelical) there’s a temptation to lower of the bar for the folks that are going out.

I wish we’d had more kids and had them sooner. Even if it would have been hard.

Not sure why we think people can handle hard to reach peoples if they can’t handle being poor (relatively) and swamped with diapers.

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It’s such a bad take by Pastor Piper I wonder if he might take it back if somebody pushed him on it.

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When he starts off the article with the assumption that he does, it’s hard to take anything else he says in the article seriously. The most charitable reading is he just had a really off day when he responded to that young woman.

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